ddoubleez

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Lets try this one now that the dust has settled and we have cooled off a bit....

It is almost impossible to have a conversation with people about the current energy situation without people bringing up all the 'off-limit' oil.... California, Alaska National Wildlife Refuge, and the gulf of Mexico come to mind....
My first response is that there just is not that much oil there, and it would do little to nothing to effect consumers or the economy...

Usually my next is to remind people that we need oil to run a military and we should not sell of our remaining 2% of oil to burn in our gas tanks, maybe in our m1a1 tanks, but not our SUV tanks..... Without an oil supply we have no defense against china or other countries... I am not aggressive, but I can not igonre that carring a big stick can keep you out of trouble, in many cases...

Then I remind people that the molecules in crude oil are unique and when we burn them they are gone for ever..... That includes 98% of pharmaceuticals, and I would rather have my health than a big car and cheep gas for a little more time.

Then I remind people that any minerals on a reserve or public land is owned by you and me, it is our legacy, saved for us by those that built this country. But some members of congress and all those in the oil industry want you to vote to have that land least to a private cooperation to sell it to the largest bidder, bad fucking deal!!!! Half of anwar oil would go to Japan, per their financing agreement, the rest would be subject to the global market, and if trends hold over 75% would be sold to china to grow their economy and their military and the US would loose more footing as the only superpower... That leaves us with 12% of our minerals sold back to us at a profit, and us with the bill to clean things up(google superfund site).

ddoubleez

I will start with the first responce(you get to do that if you have multi-personalities):

BackdoorJesus

If we leave the oil in the ground in Alaska, some other country, like China, may want to get aggressive with us up there to get it.

At least if we drill it we get the oil before the Yellow Peril does.

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ddoubleez

That is one of my points though, they will just buy it if we drill it....

Which will china be more aprehensive of a contest, or a transaction?

onlyalad

Yesterday, I was listen to Darrell Issa, he used to be my Congressman but because of term limits he is now Congressman for North San Diego County and part of Riverside County. He was talking about this. He is in favor of using this oil now. He used the saying that it would be like a business card on a football field to describe the impact on the environment. That the Alaskan Oil Pipeline is not being used to its full potential. He did mention that it would not reduce prices soon or by much, but then pushed that argument aside. He also brought up that it would cost 3 times as much to recover that oil then what we are using now.
I am not a tree hugger but I don't see the point in sucking that oil out if it is not going to reduce the price of oil. It just means that Exxon or some other company will make a little more.
He did say that it would create jobs for Americans. At the North Pole (ok the Arctic Circle). So how does this help the people he represents in SoCal? And who says that they would hire Americans?

joerockhead

Well, I would have to say that ddoubleez started this thread off with some very good points. I was rather surprised to read those comments, and almost caught up in them.

But then I realized he is just babbling BS!!!

Ok, not really, just trying to get things wound.

Actually, those are good points, and good facts. Things most people do not think about - Military uses of Oil. A true huge amount at that as well.
All the ships, less Carriers, are Gas Turbine now. Lots of fuel burned daily.

Plus, the location in ANWR is tough to get into and out of.

So, we do need to adjust, and we do need to make changes.
I just fear this means the 2010 Camaro will never be built!!

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fmb

joerockhead: the Camaro will be built, even if I have to build you one myself! Yes, drilling in ANWR will not SOLVE the problem, but it will help with our problems. Just a few days ago, DEMS were able to block a proposal to drill for oil about 32 miles of many of our southern states' coasts. Yes, these drillings will not see the light of day for about 15 years, but in my mind, this is known as "forecasting" for our fulfillment of needs. Am I ranting about DEMS? No, just saying this BS we are all paying the price for is political.

I must say, these go aheads should be given only if we (as a superpower) develop an energy policy. I'll also say you will not be a long lived superpower without an energy policy...

Greven359

I would like to point out that it was President Clinton in 1995 who said taht Anwar would make a difference because it would take 10+ years for even the first drop of oil to be pumped out. while it just drilling in this one place will not make a difference in the gas price by itself, a more exploritory energy policy would.

A more effective energy policy would make use of our other natural resources (coal and natural gas) in addition to keeping other countries (China and india) from slant drilling off our shores.

Car Enthusiast

yeah leave it alone, the higher the gas prices get the faster we get off of it

and the price of gas now has nothing to do with supply and demand

ddoubleez

This is a confusing contradiction, could you explain?

Car Enthusiast

there are many reasons why gas prices have risen, but the supply demand thing is probably the smallest reason behind it. They could pump more oil, but that would lower price, so there is a supply there but it is being manipulated for more profit. I mean we haven't really experienced a shortage have we, so the supply/demand aspect is purely man made. Big oil is raising prices because they can. They know it, they see that in the future we will be off of it and are getting it in while they can, honestly I can't blame them, it is actually pretty smart on their part.

what I was getting at with that post is people are dumb and would use gas until the last drop dripped out of the ground then look around and ask what went wrong, this way with increasing price is the only way people will look to other energies before it actually ends up hurting society

ddoubleez

So big oil and opec are in bed? They are complete opposites... Opec is in controll more than big oil, and opec is producing flat out......

You need to understand that opec has nothing to do with the oil companies and opec countries have not been able to pump what they have promissed for the past several years.......

We will be producing as much oil as we possibly can till society collapses...

Juan.©amaney

Yes, because without oil, we are all doomed. Except all those tribes and amish people and junk.

I say, the status quo is nice and good. We've seen people change their ways and oil is a business.

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