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so that will stay in the pledge of allegiance for the time being, but i was thinking, the athiest father said that this phrase was promoting a certain religion, but if they take that out of the pledge of allegiance, wouldn't that be kinda like him promoting his? i mean if he has his way and the pledge doesn't promote any religion isn't that kinda like promoting athieism

and i forget which justice said it, but i agreed with it, the pledge isn't a making someone choose a religion, but a oath of loyalty to our country, (not the exact quote, but you get the idea)

btw, the ruling will not stay long since the supreme court decided to wuss out and say the father did not have grounds cause he wasn't the legal guardiam, now all it will take is a legal guardian to bring the whole issue up again

mxpxbigd285

yea they didnt even rule on the "under god" part. they just told him he had no grounds to bring a suit against it. we'll see how it goes when a legal guardian complains.

Andytsi95

I think it needs to stay, If the parents dont want thier kids to say it, then ask for them to be excused for standing up and saying the pledge of allegiance.

TigerLand

These fuckers live in and Breathe America all their lives and now over the past few years they now want to change how a country has been ran all these years. Shame on those fuckers...shame on them.
If you don't like majority rule then it's simple...FUCK OFF :rock:

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All In Red...All In

mxpxbigd285

if only it were that simple, things would be in much better shape.

for the majority, anyways.

TigerLand

I blame most of the Lawyers and Jessie Jackson making money of all this shit.Jackson black mailing corporations for not having enough minorities in their work force and the scum bag lawyers for making a quick buck of the backs of the minorities and trying to change the laws for the newest face in town.

___________________________________________
All In Red...All In

mxpxbigd285

welcome to america, where people can and will bring your ass to court for ANYTHING :happycow:

LS1-S10

It almost makes me puke when i hear stuff like this. Since the beginning of our country, god has been a part of it. All i can say is that im glad i live in the semi-rural south were people still go to church and believe in our father.

subucni

Ok, here's my opinion on the matter...

First, while having "under God" in the pledge does in some way promote religion, taking it out does not promote atheism. There is a difference between not promoting religion, and promoting the lack of belief.

Second, while religion has played a role since the beginning of our country, if interpreted literally, the Constitution does call for the separation of church and state. This means that nothing the government does or supports should involve any hint of religion. Although I don't believe everything should be taken word for word. Andy is right by saying that if a parent disagrees with the reciting of the Pledge, they can simply ask for their child to be removed while it is said. No big deal. Saying the pledge didn't bother me growing up. Now, I am not religious, but I still will say the pledge if it is being said. I am proud and thankful to live in the US, and saying those two words doesn't matter to me. The Pledge is to show support for your country.

In response to LS1-S10, I have nothing against religion, atheism, or beliefs, as long as they don't discriminate against anyone. However, I do see a few problems in what you've said. Please understand I dont mean this as an attack, just some feedback and simply stating my opinion on the matter.



Your saying this seems to in some way go against how our country was founded. The original pilgrims came to escape religious pursecution so they could practice their religion freely. This country is now a place where people of any race or religion are free to come and live their lives how they want and to worship however they want. Only a small percentage of fanatics try to prevent this. You sound like you really want religion, specifically YOUR religion to be a major part of the way this country runs. This is counter to the basic idea of why people first came here from Europe. Also, coming from an unbiased observer, while I don't believe fully in any religion, I am not atheist, more just confused or undecided. When people say things the way you have, while you are passionate in what you believe in, which is in no way a bad thing, it is obvious you think that what you believe in is right and should be seen in that way.

On my part, it would be unfair to not expect and support people thinking that what they believe in is right. But because of the way our country was founded, and the fact that there is no endorsed religion or endorsed idea that religion in itself should be supported by the government, I don't think it should have any part in the functions of our ruling bodies. There are many different religions in the world and our country and not all have the same beliefs as Christianity. The government in any way supporting or endorsing God in the Judeo/Christian sense or Jesus is unfair to every other religion which does not hold the same beliefs. It is for this reason, that religion in general should not be supported by the government.

In the end, however, I do think that this atheist dad needs to take the stick out of his ass and just let things flow. I respect tradition too, and the Pledge of Allegance is a tradition in our country. People are not always going to agree with the way things are, but if its not a big deal, just leave it alone. You can create more problems in opposing something you don't believe in than just letting it be. Even though the Pledge's wording does in some way violate the separation of church and state, it does nothing to force religion on anyone. To me, "under God" were just two of the words that helped make up something that I say to show my support for the country I live in.

LS1-S10

I understand fully what your saying. I dont have any problem with someone else worshiping some other kinda religion, but its when they try to infringe on the majority of the countries religious beliefs it kinda just pisses on everything the constitution stands for. This whole country is pretty much a single rule of you can be free and do whatever you want....just as long as it doesnt interfer with someone else rights.

Our right to have one nation under god in the pledge of allegiance has absolutely no infringement of the other person's right to keep there mouth shut and cover there ears. If i practiced some other kinda religion where there was no god, i would simply pledge my alligance and leave the word God out of it. Simple as that.....why do people have to be so damned difficult. All i was trying to say is that its OUR history as a nation that christianity was the majority of the founding fathers beliefs.

Its like if a certain group of people were to say the Civil War upsets there beliefs....so we should take it out of text books across the United States. I still think it was REALLY sad when they took the 10 Commandments out of that courthouse in Alabama. Ranks right up there with how bad it pissed me off when they changed the Georgia state flag because some people look at the Confederate Flag as being racist. Sure, lets just forget all about all of the Southerners that died in the Civil War because of there beliefs.

subucni

Well, I personally believe the removal of the 10 commandments was the right thing to do. That was blatantly against what the Constitution says. The fact that it was ordered by one person in a position of power in the government makes it even more so. The statue could be placed on personal property, but in a public government owned spot is simply not legal.

i3eeker

Wow tigerland, it continues to amaze me how ignorant and racist you are.



I guess we should've told the kurds in Iraq, and the women in Afghanistan, or the jews in Germany, to all fuck off instead of helping them. Just because a country has been ran that way for many years and the majority like it, doesn't mean it's a good thing.

TigerLand

Hey...are you trying to tell me that all my American brothers and sisters that are happy with the way their country is and always has been are wrong and racist?
Think before you speak snapper head because i know for a fact that most Americans love their country and don't like or want new faces changing the laws and the way of life.

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All In Red...All In

i3eeker

When i said racist i was refering to some of your other posts....



And by making a blatant statement such as

You also prove yourself to be ignorant.